Category: the Rant Board
So I'm a male and I'm submissive both in friendships and relationships, particularly in sexual intimacy. Nothing wrong with that, right? Then why do girls think it's creepy that I'm so subservient, and my male friends think I have a psychological problem or something. It pisses me off and hurts me. It's just who I am. Just because I'm not dominant, just because I prefer to sit quietly by a girl's feet like a puppy rather than "take control," why should that make me creepy or messed up?!
Allow me to drop a little perspective on the situation.
First, I really don't know what it is people mean by 'I'm just being me!' or 'that's just who I am,' as a means for everyone to have to just accept it. After all, their lack of acceptance, is in fact, 'just who they are,' by your own line of thinking.
If an overly assertive high-voltage guy wanted to tell girls 'That's just who I am! It really hurts when you don't accept me!' the current culture may well not accept it either.
Typically introverts get misunderstood as being snooty or uppity, while extroverts get misunderstood for being selfish or domineering. And, those of us in the middle are often perceived as either not caring, indifferent, mediocre. We all get misunderstood.
Now I knew a lot of guys like you in the early 90s, when playing at submissive behavior was all the rage. I'm not syaing you are playing, but i am saying that for awhile it was trendy, so guys would actually try to atone for the sins of their fathers against women, by playing at the submissive, mealy-mouthed game. And in those days, women thought it was cute, interesting, but I am not sure about sexy. In fact, looking back, I think they thought it was more like having a puppy. Your puppy example was perfect. These guys thought they were being so enlightened. Enlightened enough, in fact, that later on when she became resentful because he would not stande up and deal with a situation, they were surprised and come to the rest of us so-called mediocre stiffs for help.
Now, most these guys are divorced, she takes at least 2/3 his income plus child support plus the house plus assets, and he gets the loser apartment in the bad part of town. And then she complains that his living situation is not conducive for their mutual kids (often she says 'her' kids), and he's a beaten dog.
If these guys were chicks, we'd be putting them up in a women's shelter to help them get better. But since they're guys, their peers more often than not find it might be more merciful to just shoot him.
I'm not sayiing it's wrong to be submissive or dominant or left-handed, right-handed, or any other tendency. But to be human is to be able to control our own tendencies, master our own destiny, and find ways to cohabitate with one another.
If you were writing as a dominant guy, trying to say, 'that's just who I am,' I'd be saying 'Cool your jets, kid. Find a way to use it and it's not wrong, but that's not all there is.'
Same thing goes for being overly submissive. It takes a certain amount of inner fortitude, outward stalwart disposition and just plain courage, strength and endurance to withstand the modern American white woman's frequent emotional meltdowns, what the kids now call drama.
A extreme high-voltage, high-octane guy has to learn a bit of courage and endurance during all that, and a guy in your position has just got to grow a pair.
Ironically, the early feminists of the 20th century had it all right: they shot for a state of equality. Egalitarian relationships with equal responsibility. It devolved via politics and idealism into the mess we now have.
But if you're looking to date heterosexual women, typically, they are still looking for one who will be a security. They're the ones talking about their choices in life, our lot is different. Somebody's got to be the man and hold down the fort, put food on the table, etc. while she is figuring out what she wants to do, living her dream, or just plain gets too stressed / any other combination of factors. That, incidentally, is not engineered by some sexist patriarch someplace. It's not your world, it's theirs. Women control a majority percentage of the financial resources in this country either directly or indirectly. Advertisers know it, hell everyone knows it.
Just like some high-voltage guy has to demonstrate that he can actually tone it down, you have to demonstrate that you can step it up on an as-needed basis. One tendency or another isn't an end-all: we all just have to control what it is we've got. Especially as men. People believe in us men enough to challenge us to do better.
I don't know: with all the so-called progress, apparently nobody believes in women enough to challenge them to do better than the nagging dramatic meltdown emotional constant stuff that goes on. Well I can't say nobody: I've seen a few challenged in recent years, and just like us, they can do better when pushed, and feel better as a consequence. But for now, and probably the foreseeable future, you've gotta develop some fortitude. It won't turn you into a knuckle-dragger, or any other lurid fantastical tale they've spun for us for 40 plus years. You'll just have guts and balls enough to hold down the fort and manage situations as they arise. If you don't, she'll think you're cute as a puppy now, but resent you later. And the change with them often takes seconds rather than days, weeks, months or years.
I'm actually engaged currently, this rant was more directed to past experiences. I reflected a bit on my above post and realized I was unclear. I'm actually more dominant than I previously stated in many aspects of my life, I'm mostly submissive during sexually intimate relationships with women. My fiance adores it, and she indulges in my submissive sexuality quite happily. But my past relationships with women have yielded confused, even disgusted attitude toward my submissive nature... These being the same women who loudly assert their hatred of men who are too controlling. Mixed messages. If someone dislikes people who are submissive/dominant or whatever, fair enough, that's their thing and I'll let it be. But mixed messages are so confusing sometimes. I'm so happy to be engaged now, to have a girl who loves it when I protect her and help her, but who is also eager to tie me down and do things to me... which I shall not elaborate upon.
Well congratulations, and yes, the mixed messages have done more to hurt progress for them than anything else, along with, like you said, hurting us in the process.
Sounds like you're in luck, and I'm glad for you.
Sadly, the mixed messages thing and the complaining goes for any group who is disenfranchised: they think it's easier to just nag, cry and complain all the time rather than fix their own problems. On the other side, there was a woman this past week who we honored in our Coast Guard Flotilla: she was a member of the spars - a group of young women who served in the Coast Guard during World War II. This is before making lots of special demands was all the rage, before all of this nonsense we have now.
Her getting up there and reporting back to us on her duties there and the honorary function she had just gone to made the rest of us look alive and proud to serve with her. I imagine World War II was pretty damned stressful, and all the other words they use at us now. I wish kids my daughter's age had that to look up to rather than the mixed-signal, dramatic types we got now. Good for you.
Ah but one way gets boring after a while.
Amen Leo!
I like guys who don't mind being submissive once in awhile, but I don't think I would like it all the time. I steer clear of guys who have fetishes because if their particular fetish is the only way they want to do things every time we get intimate, it can be very boring. Just like guys I've heard complain about their wives or girlfriends only wanting to have sex in the missionary position, I think anyone, male or female, who wants one thing only would be boring to be with.
As usual: well stated leo
Yes, well said Leo.
And yeah, one thing all the time would absolutely get boring. That said, you can never avoid people with fetishes, everyone has at least some sort of fetish. It's people who only fixate on that one fetish, with no room to try anything else, that are tiresome...
So are you saying your multi fetished Viking Metal Warrior?
Hmm? Smile.
Quite possibly.
In all relationships, be clear about your abilities and expectations. Friendship, family, business, sex, whatever: be clear. The end.
Some females like submissive males. Some females like females. Some males like to be submissive, some like feet. There's a niche out there for everyone and more than a couple willing partners to play a role in it, and I think having a frank discussion at the onset is a good idea.
That being said, hell yes for switching. That way everyone gets a turn.